Revisiting Kamtza and Bar Kamtza --- or Kamtza and (Bar)Bat Kamtza Revisiting Us

Author’s note – I initially wanted to title this post “Because of Kamtza and Bnot Kamtza was the House Destroyed”. But I had used that title for an overview of the Miriam Shear incident that I wrote eleven years ago [almost] to the day. I went with an alternative post title. This only enforces the message of this post which is that Bar Kamtza (or Bat Kamtza) is with us today.

All information in this post is the [alleged] truth. It is based on information publicly available on Internet forums and media and has been mentioned and sourced in previous posts.

Last Motzaei Shabbos (Tisha B’Av), I was sitting on the floor with absolutely nothing to do but to reflect on why we have not yet merited redemption and why we must still observe it today. My thoughts made me face up to a very unpleasant reality.

We know the famous Yerushalmi that says, כל מי שלא נבנה ביהמ"ק בימיו כאילו הוא חורבו . Any person that in his days the Temple was not built, it’s as if he destroyed it himself. Do we really destroy it ourselves?

The sad answer lies in the well-known adage: Those who forget the past, are condemned to repeat it. If we see that we are making the same mistakes, we have not yet learned our lesson.

Even after all this time!

Let’s think. Why was the last Temple destroyed to begin with? Of course, the quick answer is Sinas Chinam. But to understand what this is, the gemara in Gittin tells us the familiar story of Kamtza-Bar Kamtza. I fear that we have Bar Kamtzas in every generation. True or not, we certainly have some in ours. And, as long as they are here, we can never be worthy of geulah.

First, let’s review the narrative:

There was a man whose friend was Kamtza and whose enemy was Bar Kamtza. Once, he made a banquet and he told his attendant to bring Kamtza but he brought Bar Kamtza. When the host saw him, he told him, “Look, you are not my friend. Why are you here? Get up and leave.” Bar Kamtza responded, “Well, I am already here so if you allow me to stay, I will pay for my portion.”  The host said, “No.” “I will pay for half of the banquet.” The host said, “No.” “I will pay for the entire banquet.” The host said, “No.” In fact, he grabbed Bar Kamtza and escorted him out. Said Bar Kamtza, “Since the Rabbis were there and they did not object, I can infer that they approve of this treatment. I will go and make a denouncement to the king.” 

And so he did. The story continues that he went to the Roman Caesar and told him that the Jews are rebelling. To prove it, he persuaded the Caesar to send an offering which he sabotaged to make it unfit to bring. This was seen as an insult to the Caesar who then sent a repression force which eventually destroyed the Temple.

Rav Yosef Chaim, the Ben Yehoyada, notes that the story does not say that the Rabbis were aware of what was going on. It only says that this was what Bar Kamtza was thinking. Ben Yehoyada refuses to accept that the Rabbis were aware of this drama. He says that they weren’t aware. It was only that Bar Kamtza presumed that they were. He continues that even according to the version in the Midrash which may indicate that the Rabbis heard the conversation, it is still not likely that they saw Bar Kamtza being led out.

We may wonder that Ben Yehoyada certainly wasn’t there, so how could he be so sure?

I think Ben Yehoyada is trying to teach us a lesson. He has no problem judging the Rabbis l’kaf zchus. But Bar Kamtza did. He also had no firm grounds to blame the Rabbis. Why did he need to take this derogatory judgmental stance?

Obviously, he chose to do it. He did it because it served his purpose.

He certainly wasn’t a friend of the host nor of the Rabbis even before this incident. He was always an outcast. He was full of hatred, anger and bitterness at the “community” and he wanted to hurt them. But he needed a trigger. He needed to be able to justify his devastating actions. This incident was all the justification he needed. He was hurt, he was humiliated, he was “molested”, he was traumatized. He was a “victim”!

When Bar Kamtza hatched his sinister plot, whose “honor” was he trying to avenge? The honor of his fellow Jews? The honor of the sages? The honor of the Torah? The honor of G-d?

None of the above. He was concerned for nothing but his own honor. The honor of Bar Kamtza and nobody else. He needed to wreak vengeance and “justice”. For who? Was he a selfless altruist who just wanted to make sure that this host would never do this to anyone else? Was he caringly trying to protect others from this same “molestation”?

Not at all. If he was, this would be a community issue, and the Roman Caesar is hardly the address for such an endeavor. He should have rallied the Jewish “askanim” to enlighten the “misguided” Rabbis.

He didn’t want to fix anything or anyone. He didn’t want to improve anything or anyone. He was acting for nobody but himself. And for his own personal gratification he stooped so low as to cut a deal with Edom. To go to the non-Jewish “superpower” to sell out his own people. He wanted “justice”, he wanted “closure”. He wanted international acclaim (I suppose he wanted to be enshrined in the Gemara Gittin for all generations). He went to the non-Jewish government and tattled for one purpose. To do damage.

And he succeeded. Why?

I can’t say for sure, but it is partially because HKBH gives a free hand to wicked people to stir up trouble in this world. And partially because we were a fractured nation. And perhaps, he was not really alone. There was very likely an entire “community” of disenfranchised Jews who backed him up and cheered him on and maybe even participated in his scheme. 

This is the Bar Kamtza that lived two thousand years ago. And, because of him and his treachery, our Beis Hamikdash was destroyed. A generation that can raise and nurture a Bar Kamtza cannot sustain a Beis Hamikdash. It’s just impossible. And if there is a Bar Kamtza in our generation, it doesn’t only tell us that we are not worthy of a Beis HaMikdash; it tells us that if we were to have a Beis HaMikdash in this time, it would be fit to be destroyed.

Do we have Bar Kamtzas in our generation? People who are quick to run to the non-Jewish authorities and sell out fellow Jews to settle a personal score? (See my first post in 2008).

All of my readers know that over the past few years I have been following an ongoing saga. The story of Bnos Kamtza. The Bnos Kamtza are three sisters that live in the land of Victoria. We can call them Bat Kamtza A – the oldest, Bat Kamtza B – the loudest (the spokesperson for the trio), and Bat Kamtza C- the youngest.

The narrative of the Bnos Kamtza goes as follows:

In the Land of Victoria there was a hostess who liked to make her own quiet “parties”. And she sent her attendants to bring Bat Kamtza – sometimes A, sometimes B. And they always brought the right person. She never asked them to leave the “banquet”. In fact, she always asked them to stay. The allegations are that the hostess was very warm and friendly toward the Bnos Kamtza. But they later claimed they did not like the “parties”. They were too private and too invasive. Hence, they felt violated. They were hurt, they were humiliated, they were “molested”, they were traumatized.

This was not a one-time event. This happened lots of times over at least four years. Bat Kamtza A was about 17 when this started and within a year, she was a full consenting adult. Bat Kamtza B was about 15 but kept coming to these “parties” for four years (whereupon, she was also a full consenting adult). Nobody forced her to come. About two years later, Bat Kamtza C started to go to the private parties on her own. Bnos Kamtza A and B claimed that they tried to warn her, but they didn’t stop her, and she would not listen to them – even though she was warned!

Of course, there were Rabbis. But were the Rabbis aware?

No, they were not.

The Bnos Kamtza did not tell the rabbis. Did they tell their parents so they could inform the Rabbis? No, they were not on good terms with their parents. Did they tell their older sisters who they are on good terms with? Doesn’t look like it. And if they did, did their responsible mature adult older sisters tell the Rabbis? No, they did not.

So the Rabbis were not aware.

Eventually, somebody told the Rabbis and the Rabbis took immediate action and saw to it that these private banquets do not go on another day. They saw to it that all of Victoria will be rid of this hostess and there were no more parties ever since. This was in the year 2008. Incidentally, it appears that the Bat Kamtza sisters A and B stopped going to these “parties” as of 2006. As far as Bat Kamtza C, it isn’t clear, but if she was still at it after 2006, she must have been having a good time.

The hostess left Victoria forever and returned to the land of Israel to which she is a born native citizen. There were no more traumatic parties after March of 2008. The Bat Kamtza sisters and all of the young maidens in Victoria were absolutely safe from this friendly hostess as of March 2008.

Yet the Bat Kamtza sisters felt hurt and traumatized. They were victims. They were victims in 2006 and in 2007 and in 2008 and in 2009 and in 2010 and in 2011 even though nobody had bothered them for at least three years and probably for five. But they were (are?) still professional victims. They felt hurt and rage and hatred, anger, and bitterness against the community and the Rabbis whom they never told. By then, at least two of these three siblings threw off the yoke of Torah observance.

Now, in 2011, the hostess has been back in Israel for no less than three years and has no plans to return. She is absolutely no threat to anybody in Victoria. But the sisters said: “Since the Rabbis weren’t there and, therefore they did not object, I can infer that they approve of this treatment. I will go and make a denouncement by the Police of Victoria (and the Prime Minister). And we will sue the Rabbis to boot!” 

And so they did. The story continues that in 2011, Bat Kamtza C, the youngest one who went on her own volition, was the first to go to the Victorian Chief of Police and tell him that the Jews of Victoria are rebelling by [three years ago] sending off their hostesses to where she came from and to ask for the hostess back (she was also a rebel). Of course, they couldn’t prove it because it happened so long ago, but in Victoria, one does not need to prove anything. The word of a “victim” is sufficient.

Why do they want the hostess brought back to Victoria?

Is it to caringly protect the young maidens of Victoria from suffering the same “molestation”?

This is quite impossible because there is no danger to any maidens in Victoria. Period.

Perhaps it is a selfless altruistic effort to protect the young maidens in the Land of Israel?

Not at all. If it was, this would be an Israeli community issue, and the Victorian Caesar is hardly the address for such an endeavor. They should have rallied the Israeli “askanim” and law enforcement authorities to protect the Israeli public. Trust me, they are more than capable.

Does the Halacha permit extraditing a Jew (even a dangerous one) outside of the land of Israel to the hands of Edom so that they can claim that they are avenging the he honor of the Jewish people? The honor of the Torah? The honor of G-d?

G-d forbid! Because G-d forbids extradition of any Jew, and even half a Jew, outside of the land of Israel. (See HERE and this teshuva from a former Dayan in the Rabbanut Beit Din HaGadol).

No. The Bnot Kamtza want to punish her for her crimes - for "justice" and "closure". 

They are concerned for nothing but their own honor and of nobody else. They need to wreak vengeance and “justice”. They don’t want to fix anything or anyone. They don’t want to improve anything or anyone. They are certainly not interested in educating the hostess to mend her ways. They are acting for nobody but themselves. 

And for their own personal gratification they need to cut a deal with Edom. To go to the non-Jewish “superpower” and to sell out the Rabbis who they deceived. They need “justice”, they need “closure”. They need international acclaim. They went to the non-Jewish government and tattled for one purpose. To do damage.

All this could be overlooked if these were just three Bat Kamtzas on a low-key personal mission that weren’t dragging the nation down with them. However, in the year 2016 they spearheaded a campaign to enlist the support of the public at large with two online petitions. The bigger of the two garnered almost 17,000 signatures (let’s presume all those who signed the second one, about 5,000, also signed the first). Even if we allow for double-dippers, it’s a lot of uninvolved people who support the Bnos Kamtza’s abrogation of Torah values and involving the nations of the world in a Jewish affair. This obviously gives much momentum for the Roman Victorian Caesar to make an international fuss.

Also, in 2016, the Royal Victorian Supreme Kangaroo court appeased the Bnot Kamtza and ordered the Rabbis who were not aware to pay off Bat Kamtza B to the tune of 1+ Million Australian dollars. As I wrote in a different post, whoever pays for this appeasement will not be the “hostess”.

In 2017, Bat Kamtza B opened a public Facebook page to further enlist the support of the secular and naïve Jewish masses to their alliance with the Caesar. Currently, there is an entire “community” of disenfranchised Jews who back them up and cheer them on and maybe even participate in their scheme. And it is amazing and frightening how many Orthodox Jews are on board with this alliance with Edom.

In 2018, it was bothering them so much that their quest for extradition wasn't bearing fruit, that they schemed with a renowned Child Safety Advocacy organization to hire a private investigator to follow this hostess around for 200 hours to prove to the world that she is fit to be extradited. Incidentally, the 200 hours did not catch any of these type of "parties" private or public. This did succeed in generating publicity and some public outrage, so the Israeli authorities put the hostess in a cell for safe keeping. 

Ever since, the publicity – and chillul Hashem – has snowballed. More and more journalists speaking their minds and more and more politicians getting involved. With the observant politicians who have tried to quietly oppose the Halachically forbidden extradition and stop this debacle having been vilified by the masses (and interrogated by the police).

So far nothing was gained. Well, they indirectly achieved getting their “hostess” incarcerated. But it is not for hosting parties. It is for not wanting to go back to Victoria after eleven years of absence (and quiet). But they have created a big media circus and international brouhaha which is helping nobody.

How and when is all this going to end? This remains to be seen, but I can promise this. It won’t end nicely for the Jews in general, not those in Israel and not those in Victoria and it certainly will not end well for the Bnos Kamtza.

It will only be a Churban!

Yesterday was another Tisha B’Av. A recurring theme that we always hear in the inspirational speeches that we listen to on Tisha B’Av is our inability to personally relate to the destruction. After all, we never knew the splendor of the Temple and the events all took place so long ago. To us it is all so distant.

Somehow, for me, as I follow these events, it doesn’t seem so distant at all. I had no trouble observing Tisha B’Av this year. It’s like I can see the Churban unfolding right before my eyes.

Related Posts:

Judging the Judges Part 2: Kangaroo Courts and the Boomerang Effect

Flirting with Danger

Dassi’s Lament

Because of Kamtza and Bat Kamtza was the House Destroyed